Lucky Gambit

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Brev

New member
This xpack has seen a sharp decline in the Swash dps curve from the last several, if this was intentional at least buff what we are known for which is the uncontested king/queen of aoe fights. Make lucky gambit noticeably stronger to put swash back on top in the aoe department when there are multiple mobs. It is becoming rather disheartening this xpack playing a swash in a top raid guild. I think a 2x to 3x damage increase would be about right.
 
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badname912

Member
I guess to start there isn't really an AOE fights this expac at all. And in current form of the swash they would still be extremely competitive pulling t1 numbers/topping in a real AOE fight.

I'll repeat this here again tho... There has definitely been a disconnect in t1 and T2 over past several years. Where everyone was basically a t1. Or maybe I'm missing it. Maybe all the "DPS classes" should be viable for t1.

But sure let's 2x-3x the damage of the highest parsing ability on the class that's already doing 20% of a parse... That would just bring u to a one hit wonder class having 60-70% damage from 1 ability... May as well play a chanter
 
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Redneck34

Member
I’m sorry but why tho? You’re trying to buff a class that’s suppose to be a T2. Swashy is in a perfect spot or needs to be brought down a little bit. You provide some of the best buffs and solid dps. I may be lost, but what swashy is losing a pure aoe fight? I may be out of the loop on that I guess
 
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Miaga

Active member
AOE fight in heroics I doubt any would touch a swash to be honest, in raid trash if you have 3 or more then swash will mostly top the parse. Single target is harder though.

I think the trouble with labelling classes is knowing what the criteria is for that label, we say rogues are T2 but who decided that and what makes them T2, is it having lots of debuffs (neither rogue has meaningful debuffs now) is it providing lots of support skills and buffs (swashie has one great buff and one ok buff, not sure Brig has anything now) so if rogues are to be be T2 then do we need work done to improve their buffs and debuffs (more for brig than swash) to make them a T2 class, while also removing any grp buffs from a T1 class? as if you are T1 why should you be buffing when your job is DPS. Roles and classes in this game have been completely lost, mostly due to completely overpowered abilities being added to classes that allow them to hit stupid numbers etc as well as so many changes to the game mechanics. The issue is the amount of work needed to fix this mess would be far greater than any resource that is available as it would require all classes, stats and then encounters to be reworked.

Do swashies need a buff to AOE dps nope not at all currently (as much as I would like to see more dps!) do swash and brigs need buffs to their debuffs yes absolutely, does a swash need some love on single target skills yes probably, do brigs need a massive amount of work to bring them up to the swash level yes they do! They could also probably both do with a few tweaks to other buffs (particularly Brigs) if they are to be true T2 classes, if we say a summoner is T2 and you look at their DPS potential and the buffs they bring is that comparable to rogues that are also meant to be T2?
 
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Jrox

Member
badname912 said:
I guess to start there isn't really an AOE fights this expac at all. And in current form of the swash they would still be extremely competitive pulling t1 numbers/topping in a real AOE fight.

I'll repeat this here again tho... There has definitely been a disconnect in t1 and T2 over past several years. Where everyone was basically a t1. Or maybe I'm missing it. Maybe all the "DPS classes" should be viable for t1.

But sure let's 2x-3x the damage of the highest parsing ability on the class that's already doing 20% of a parse... That would just bring u to a one hit wonder class having 60-70% damage from 1 ability... May as well play a chanter
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Do you play a top-end Swash? Lucky Gambit is not even close to 20% of my parse and I am not sure there are many pushing my numbers in a raid setting. At least I haven't seen any.

The real issue is that the Swash is super grp dependent on being viable. Something needs to be done to correct that issue, I have some ideas but nothing worth mentioning yet as I am still working out all the kinks and gaining knowledge from other swashy's I chat with as well as classes that we heavily rely on to be viable.

The disparity from T1-T2 is crazy right now. For instance, 2 - T2 DPS classes still can only hit about 60% of what one Assassin can do in dmg. Add to it Coercers spiking on Mimic makes them T2's. Support classes should not be parsing with T2's, just as T2's should not be parsing with T1's. There should be some way to remove these GRP-dependent restrictions on Swashbucklers. I would be willing to bet 95% of Swashy's really struggling are the ones that have not figured out or do not have access to the perfect grp setup.
 
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Jrox

Member
Redneck34 said:
I’m sorry but why tho? You’re trying to buff a class that’s suppose to be a T2. Swashy is in a perfect spot or needs to be brought down a little bit. You provide some of the best buffs and solid dps. I may be lost, but what swashy is losing a pure aoe fight? I may be out of the loop on that I guess
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If your not a swash and don't play one you have nothing of substance to add to the conversation in my opinion. I prefer we look for real balance and not constantly down others trying to make real progress towards balance.

And if you do know and play a Swash, then elaborate on why you "think" the way you do.
 
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Redneck34

Member
Jrox said:
If your not a swash and don't play one you have nothing of substance to add to the conversation in my opinion. I prefer we look for real balance and not constantly down others trying to make real progress towards balance.

And if you do know and play a Swash, then elaborate on why you "think" the way you do.
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Real balance would imply stop trying to buff something that’s already at the top of the parse. I’m all for real balance but there’s a reason this has soo many down votes.
 
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Jrox

Member
Neither of the abilities Brev describes is at the top of a swashy's parse. And if they are, your not playing it right, and just further proves my point.
 
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Deadheals

New member
if the intention is for swash to do damage. regardless of autoattack as thats so back and forth.. simply asking to buff the top 2 abilities is silly. Why not take the approach the devs did with the warlock. The top 2 abilities are already strong, why not buff the middle ground? For the lock for example they didnt touch appoc or plaguebringer but instead chose other abilities that were doing poorly.. and it made a massive impact in their playability and are much more desirable than they were. Simply buffing the #1 ability of any class is a silly way to balance.
It's already #1, and its even #1 on single target.

The argument should be finding other abilities that simply feel casting them is a waste of time and space, however they are currently only in the cast order because a) you have nothing else or b) it can reset LG or DS.. ... ask for a increase in these damage instead
 
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Jrox

Member
The problem is LG and Strike are not hitting like they did a few months back. Something took a hit. They should at least be brought back in line with the begining of the xpack. It's like were taking hits in the dark with no mention of it in any patch notes. And my stats have only gotten way better so it's probably even worse than what I think as far as the hit they have taken.
 
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RubyHOF

New member
I'm not sure what problems people are having on their swash, my 2 swashes are still doing just fine.

LG / DS still number one parsing, and the rest of the CAs are mostly a method to get DS/LG to reset more often.

I've messaged you on Discord Jrox, would be interested to see what you mean by your comment on LG/DS
 
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Reshi

New member
swash doesn't need any buff. if anything their buff need a nerf...

they are an excellent class. the issue is raids need boss with 2 or 3 adds for the swash to shine. so rather than posting here and asking for buff, go to the raid developer and ask for different kind of encounter.
 
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Miaga

Active member
Currently abilities wise swash relys on a couple abilities to do dps, these abilities as people have pointed out have been lowered since the expac has been launched, gambit and swathe don't need a lot of work but they do need to be bought back the level they were at. Swash also needs work on other abilities (brig needs alot of work as well) as like a lot of classes we have a load of skills that are just useless.
 
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Jrox

Member
Reshi said:
swash doesn't need any buff. if anything their buff need a nerf...

they are an excellent class. the issue is raids need boss with 2 or 3 adds for the swash to shine. so rather than posting here and asking for buff, go to the raid developer and ask for different kind of encounter.
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I did ask for more linked encounters.

I will add and reiterate, LG/DS - Neither should be topping a Swashy's parse. And in all honesty they don't need a buff. Swashy's and Brigs need more utility. They are T2's, and if the disparity from T1 to a T2 is going to remain the way of things to come, more utility will provide more balance. Groups shouldn't be forced to run with a T1 to do the H3. Currently, it is nearly impossible without a really good T1.
 
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